Monday, April 18, 2011

Andre LaCombe -- More than One Family? Not Likely

ANDRE LACOMBE
m. M.-Louise Gagne
m. Josette Quirion
m. Josette Roy
m. Josette -------
(all St.Francois de Beauce)

I believe M.-Louise Gagne, Josette Gagne, Josette Quirion, Josette Roy, and Josette 
----- are all the same person.
1850 Waterville census:  Andre b. 1790, Sophie b. 1792
son Jo. b. 1826  (probably Fereol b. 14-1-1824)
son Ed b. 1828  (Edouard b. 7-10-1826)
son Charles b. 1831 (Charles b. 25-2-1832)
dau Mary b. 1833  (probably son Cyrille b. 12-9-1834)
son David b. 1838  (probably Damase b. 9-10-1839 in Waterville)

PROOF:

FAM. A: children of Andre Lacombe & M.-Louise Gagne
#1 Frederic                     b. 1810 Apr 3                   GP: Jean-M. Rodrigue & M.-Louise Doyon (see A11 & A3)

FAM. B: children of Andre Lacombe & Josette Quirion
#5 Joseph                    b. 1817 May 12                  GP: Pierre Boucher & Marie Martineau (see A4 & A8)
#6 Sophie                    b. 1819 Apr 8                     GP: Francois Doyon & Brigitte Miray  (see A7)
#7 Francois (d.1825)   b. 1822 Jan 20                    GP: Athanase Morin & Marie Mathieu   (see A5)
#8 Fereol                     b. 1824 Jan 14                     GP: Joseph Latulippe & Josette Quirion (see A10)
#10 Zoe                       b. 1829 Aug 21                   GP: Frederic Lacombe & Sylvie Gagne  (see A6)
#11 Charles                 b. 1832 Feb 25                   GP: Pierre Veilleux & Divine Boucher (see A9)

FAM. C: children of Andre Lacombe & Josette Roy
#4 Adelaide                  b. 1815 Apr 6                   GP: Joseph Toulouse & M.-Anne Doyon (see A8, A4 & A13)
                                            
FAM. D: children of Andre Lacombe & Josette --------
#2 Francois-George      b. 1811 Dec 5                     GP: Jean-Bte. Grondin & M.-Genevieve Roy (See A3 & A11)
#9 Edouard                    b. 1826 Oct 7                     GP: Louis Thibodeau + Louise Gagne  (see A1 below)
#12 Cyrille                    b. 1834 Sep 12                   GP: Remi Veilleux & Marguerite Poulin (see A2 & A12)

FAM. E: children of Andre Lacombe & Josette Gagne
#3 Luce                         b. 1813 Jul 14 *                      GP: Augustin Bolduc & Marie Doyon  (see A14)
                                     d. 1814  Jan 1  St.Frs. age 6 mos.
                                    *b. at St.Joseph
------------------

Andre Lacombe mar. 10 Jan 1809 M.-Louise Gagne
(Joseph Lacombe & Josette Carbonneau) (Jean-M. Gagne for the father)
witnesses:  Siblings of Andre Lacombe:
Charles Lacombe (mar. 1803 Marguerite Turgeon)
Joseph Lacombe (mar. 1787 Catherine Larochelle)
Joseph Gautron (Larochelle) & Joseph Nadeau brothers-in-law of Andre Lacombe, 
Jean-Marie Gagne for the father, Pierre Boucher, Jean Grondin

#1 Frederic Lacombe mar. 15 Jan 1833 Sylvie Gagne
      (Andre Lacombe & M.-Josette ______)

#2 Francois-George Lacombe mar. 18 Nov 1834 Adelaide Thibodeau
      (Andre Lacombe & M.-Josette ______)

#4 Adelaide Lacombe mar. 8 Oct 1833 Francois Latulippe
      (Andre Lacombe & Josette _______)

#6 Sophie Lacombe mar. 12 Jan 1841 Henri-Jean Poulin
     (Andre Lacombe & Josette Quirion)

--------------------
A1       Louis Thibodeau mar. M.-Louise Gagne 1801 Beauceville
            (Louise is daughter of Louis-M. Gagne & Jeanne Cloutier m. 1770 St.Joseph)
A2       (Louis-M. Gagne 2m. 1817 Marguerite Poulin at Beauceville)
A3       M.-Louise Doyon m. 1807 Jean-Bte. Grondin at Beauceville)
A4       Pierre Boucher 1m. Catherine Perras 1798 at Beauceville
                 "           "        2m. M.-Anne Doyon 1839 at Beauceville
            Marie Martineau m. Joseph Toulouse 1812 at Beauceville)
            THIS CONNECTS FAM. B to FAM. C.
A5        Athanase Morin m. Marie Mathieu 1820 at Beauceville)
A6        Frederic Lacombe & Sylvie Gagne m. 1833 at Beauceville)
            Sylvie Gagne is 16 year-old daughter of Augustin Gagne & M.Jeanne Mathieu 
            m. 1811 Beauceville
            Frederic Lacombe is 19 year-old son of Andre and Josette "Quirion"
            THIS CONNECTS FAM. A to FAM.B.
A7       Francois Doyon is probably the one who m. Mgte. Rodrigue 1805 in Beauceville.
            Brigitte Miray m. 1694 to Godfroid Bernard at Lauzon and moved to Beauceville.
A8       Joseph Toulouse 2m. Marie Martineau in 1812 at Beauceville (1m. Angele Veilleux 1795)
A9       Pierre Veilleux m. Luce Toulouse 1830 at Beauceville.
            (Luce Toulouse is daughter of Joseph Toulouse & Angele Veilleux - see A8)
            THIS CONNECTS FAM. B to FAM. C.
A10      Joseph Latulippe (1m. Mgte. Dion 1803) 2m. M.-Louise Rancourt 1810 at Beauceville 
            Son, Francois Latulippe, mar. Adelaide Lacombe 1833, dau. of Andre & Josette Roy
            No marriage nor birth info for Josette Quirion.
A11      Jean-M. Rodrigue & M.-Genevieve Roy m. 1788 St.Joseph, Beauce
            (M.-Genevieve 2m. Louis Poulin 1825 at Beauceville)
            THIS CONNECTS FAM. A to FAM. D.
A12     Remi Veilleux m. Marie Poulin 1836 at Beauceville
            (Remi is son of Pierre Veilleux & Judith Mathieu m. 1812 Beauceville)
A13     M.-Anne Doyon 1m. Joseph Lacombe 1809 in Beauceville; 2m. 1839 Pierre Boucher,             
           widower of Catherine Perras.
            THIS CONNECTS FAM. B to FAM. C.
A14     This is most likely Augustin Bolduc who mar. Catherine Doyon in 1807 at Beauceville.
            Catherine is the sister of Marie Doyon who m. Jean-Bte. Grondin - see #2 and A3.
            THIS CONNECTS FAM. E to FAM. A.

Nothing on Divine Boucher & Josette Quirion
There is no other marriage of an Andre Lacombe in Quebec.

CONCLUSION: with little doubt, these are all children of the same couple.
Question is: what was Josette's birth name, if any?
Was it :
M.-Josette Gagne, illegit. daughter of Louis Gagne (who m. Jeanne Cloutier in 1770)? or was it
M.-Josette Roy, illegitimate daughter of Genevieve Roy (who. m. Jean Rodrigue in 1788)? or was it
M.-Josette Quirion, illegitimate daughter of Josette Quirion?
Most assuredly they are all children of the same couple.

Might she be M.-Josette sauvagesse, born Dec 1790 at St.Joseph? Daughter of Francois-Joseph & Marie Sauvages.
~By Robert Chenard December 31, 2003
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Further analysis. Recall that Jean-Marie Gagne stood in for the father at the marriage of Andre Lacombe.










Jean-Marie GAGNE, born 1737 St. Vallier, died 20 May 1809 in St. Francois-de-Beauce, Beauceville.

He married (1) Marie-Francoise RODRIGUE, 07-01-1766 in Saint-Joseph, Saint-Joseph-de-Beauce, 
Beauce, QC, born 1721, (daughter of Vincent RODRIGUE and Angelique GIROUX) died 07-03-1786, 
buried 09-03-1786 in Saint-Francois-d'Assise, Beauceville, Beauce, QC.
He married (2) Marie BOULET, 13-11-1786 in Saint-Francois-d'Assise, Beauceville, Beauce, QC, 
(daughter of Pierre BOULET and Marie-Genevieve ALBERT).



Let's look at each of the above possibilities raised by Robert Chenard.  Is there any connection to Jean-Marie Gagne?
M.-Josette Gagne, illegit. daughter of Louis Gagne (who m. Jeanne Cloutier in 1770)?
 ---------This Louis Gagne was Louis-Marie Gagne (1747-1822). the younger brother of Jean-Marie Gagne.
More on Louis-Marie:  His third spouse (m. 1820) was Marie Louise Quirion Daniel who had had an illegitimate son with Augustin 
Veilleux whom she later married.  
 He was a witness to his brother Jean-Marie’s wedding.

 Louis-Marie GAGNE (son of Pierre) and Marie-Jeanne CLOUTIER were married 27 Aug 1770 at St-Joseph, Beauce, QC.

 Louis-Marie GAGNE and Marguerite POULIN were married 15 Sep 1817 at St-Francois de Beauce, QC.

 Louis-Marie GAGNE and Louise QUIRION were married 19 Sep 1820 at St-Francois de Beauce, QC.


M.-Josette Roy, illegitimate daughter of Genevieve Roy (who. m. Jean Rodrigue in 1788) (parents: deceased Thomas Roy & Marie 
Josephe Huard dit Desilets)?
----------This Jean Rodrigue was Jean-Marie Rodrigue, a stepson of Jean-Marie Gagne and son Marie Joseph Boulet and Jean-Baptiste 
Rodrigue.  Jean-Marie Gagne documented as step-father to Jean Rodrigue at his wedding to Genevieve Roy. 


Another Marie Josette Roy in the family: Andre's parents Joseph Lacombe and M. Josette Carbonneau of Berthier had a son named Francois Lacombe who was married to Marie-Josette Roy (b.1770) (daughter of Francois Roy and Rosalie Tanguay) on 21 Oct 1797 at St. Vallier in County Bellechase.  This information is from the Compte Bellechase repertoire at ACGS.  He was a navigator who died two years later on 26 November 1799 at St. Vallier.  This Marie Josette Roy would be the widowed sister in law of Andre.


M.-Josette Quirion, illegitimate daughter of Josette Quirion?
---------M. Josette Quirion (parents: Francois Daniel dit Kirion & Marie Marguerite Bolduc) was born 4 Feb 1764 atSt-Joseph-de-Beauce.  I did not find a marriage nor an illegitimate daughter.  However, her father Francois Daniel Quirion was a first cousin and friend to Jean-Marie Gagne's first wife Marie Francoise Rodrigue as documented at their marriage.  Two of Jean-Marie Gagne's relatives by spouse Marie Joseph Boulet were Quirions, Quirion m. Boucher and Quirion m. Roy.  M. Marguerite Bolduc Quirion had remarried Joseph Boulet in 1799.  This made her a sister in law to Jean-Marie Gagne's wife M. Joseph Boulet.  M. Marguerite Bolduc's brother married Louise Quirion,  Their daughter Felicite Quirion married Charles Roy.  Their daughter Marguerite Quirion married Pierre Boucher.

Josette ------- , Might she be M.-Josette sauvagesse, born Dec 1790 at St.Joseph? Daughter of Francois-Joseph & Marie Sauvages.  It would be consistent with parish registries not to include a last name or parents names at her sacraments.


Conclusion:  An analysis shows Jean-Marie Gagne, who represented the father at Andre's marriage,  had no children of his own.  He married two widows and had step-children.  He had a brother Louis-Marie who was ten years younger.  Louis-Marie had an illegitimate daughter, Marie-Josette Gagne.  He was a stepfather to Jean Rodrigue whose wife Genevieve Roy had an illegitimate daughter M. Josette Roy.   Marie Josette Quirion was a first cousin to his first wife.  Jean-Marie was a step relative to two Quirions, one of whom was married to a Roy.  It is conceivable that Jean-Marie Gagne could have represented the father at the marriage of any of these illegitimate children.


As for Native Heritage, I have Native Heritage through both of my grandmothers.  This line that I am tracing is through a grandfather, Albert Alphonse Poulin.  He was the great-grandson of this mysterious bride of Andre Lacombe via his daughter Sophie Rosalie Lacombe married to Henri-Jean Poulin (John Pooler).  John Pooler settled in Waterville shortly after the LaCombe family.  Of note, my grandfather Albert Poulin had aqua blue eyes and a ruddy but not red skin tone.  He was friendly with the Passamaquoddy Indians while serving in the Maine State Legislature.


As mentioned in my last post, I am considering genetic testing to pursue solving this brick wall.  I welcome hearing from any relatives of my ancestors.  I especially welcome receiving information, documentation, and photographs.  Thank you.




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